Article published by Ouest France on 7 June 2025. Translated with the kind permission of Ouest France. Read the article in French on Ouest France website: ENTRETIEN. Le PDG de Thales : « J’alerte sur le risque de déclassement de notre industrie spatiale ».

Europe needs to make every effort in the field of space

From managing climate data to defending the country, a lot is playing out in space. Europe has assets, but the Thales boss warns of the risks of being left behind.

---

Europe is re-arming. Could the lack of engineers hinder France’s ambitions in the defence sector?

Every year, 40,000 students graduate from engineering schools, but France Industrie estimates that we need at least double that number. The other challenge is to attract as many young women as possible into science. Without an increase in the number of engineers, there will be no economic sovereignty. 

Does this present a problem for your business?

Thales has no trouble finding the people it needs. Last year, we hired 8,000 people around the world and received one million job applications. We are fortunate to also have our own academies – around thirty of them, currently – to recruit and train internally. 

Is a standard engineering degree no longer sufficient?

Just because you know how to solve equations doesn’t mean you can become an expert in underwater acoustics overnight. On the other hand, SMEs and mid-cap companies, which are a vital part of our country’s industry, do not have the same resources, and may struggle to find the people they need.

The Ukrainian defence industry won’t be present at this year’s Paris Air Show. Do you have partnerships with the country?

We already have many defence partnerships with countries in the Middle East and Asia that are looking to build their capabilities. We do this via our subsidiaries, through joint ventures or simple business partnerships. We do have ongoing talks with Ukraine, but until they’ve come to fruition, I prefer to remain cautious.  

There is no defence indutry without factories. The CGT [a French trade union] is worried about the risks of deindustrialisation. Do you share its concern?

We share the same ambition with all the major trade unions: to make industry a priority. The share of this sector within GDP (gross domestic product) has gone from 20% to 10% in just a few decades. We are largely outperformed by Germany, for which this sector represents 24% of GDP, but also by the UK, which has major research centres and a solid industrial base. The exception in Europe, unfortunately, is France, which has massively deindustrialised over the last twenty years.

Can France get back in the race?

Since 2017, the French President has made reindustrialisation a priority focus of development. This is a long-term effort that must be sustained if we are to return to 12%, then 15% and, hopefully one day, to 20% of GDP. This can only be achieved over a decade and with sustained effort.

Aren’t the many redundancy plans recently announced within the industry an indication that this policy has failed?

No, I don’t think that they are – I think this is proof that we must maintain these effort to reindustrialise and work harder than ever on the competitiveness of French industry.

A parliamentary commission of inquiry is looking into subsidies to large companies. What are your thoughts on that?

It seems to me that it is right to be accountable for public authority support given to companies. However, I don’t agree with those who criticise the French tax credits that are the envy of – and copied by – many countries. France has high-quality research and high-level engineers. For example, 19,000 research engineers at Thales in France are dedicated to R&D, in which we invest more than €4 billion a year. However, our country is not competitive in terms of costs. Without the CIR [research tax credit], on a basis where the cost in France would be 100, the UK is at 72, Spain at 56 and India at 29. With the CIR, France is down to 73 and just about in the middle range. The CIR is vital to maintaining research centres across the country. 

What are the risks involved?

If you let research centre go, it’s likely that factories will eventually close down. We need to offer prospects to all young people, regardless of their level of qualification – not just engineers, but also workers and technicians. 

Do your subcontractors (SMEs and mid-caps) benefit from this research support?

The CIR is open to all companies. If they are involved in research, SMEs and mid-caps can benefit from the CIR on the same basis as large companies. 89% of CIR beneficiaries are SMEs.  

Is this what allows you to develop Thales site in Cholet today?

Cholet plays a key role in modernising the armed forces by developing radio communications, as well as cybersecurity, electronic warfare and satellite communication systems. The strong demand from defence customers and in particular from the Armed Forces Ministry, combined with the excellence of our products, are the two foundations of the dynamics of our Cholet site.

What are your ambitions on this site and in the west of France?

In Cholet, we are drawing on an investment and transformation plan that will allow us to continue the expected ramp-up in production. We already have a new logistics hub there, which has been operational since mid-2024. A new R&D centre of excellence will be operational by mid-2025. Finally, a new industrial site for the production of equipment and systems will complete this development in 2028.

What does the Atlantic coast region bring to Thales?

The west of France is a good reflection of how Thales is rooted in France. It’s an area of new technologies, and the cradle of telecoms and innovations of the future, thanks to a dense industrial landscape and the strength of the Breton education system. The latter has one of the best baccalaureat [high school diploma] success rates in France. Thales has had a strong presence in Brittany since 1983, with more than 3,000 employees at its sites in Brest (underwater acoustics), Rennes (sovereign cybersecurity), Etrelles (microelectronics, including for the Rafale) and Cholet. 

Space have become a key issue for sovereignty. Is Europe devoting enough funds to the space sector?

Every three years, there is a very important meeting: the ministerial conference, where the countries that contribute to the European Space Agency announce their funding for the next three years. This event will take place at the end of 2025. It is this budget that will then be passed on to the European space industry and in particular to Thales. If the contributions from different countries, and in particular France, decrease, I would once again warn that we risk downgrading our industry.

But is Europe not already behind the US in this area?

We are at world-best level! And not just in relation to the Americans, but also to the Chinese, who are investing heavily in this area. India also aspires to become an autonomous space power on par with the US, China and Europe. 

And yet it’s in this sector that you cut a thousand jobs a year ago.

In 2024, Thales Alenia Space launched an internal mobility plan without any forced departures. 1,000 people in France were impacted. The size of our growing high-tech company and the diversity of our defence, aerospace and cybersecurity businesses have made it possible to carry out these mobilities internally. 

Was it not in response to demands from the financial markets?

It is an adaptation plan aimed at responding to a profoundly changing market. We want to remain a leading global space player. The accessible market for commercial geostationary telecommunications satellites has been halved over the past four years. In the observation, exploration and navigation market, the space industry is largely supported by institutional players that make up two-thirds of Thales Alenia Space’s customers, such as the CNES [the French national space research centre] and the European Space Agency. There is a ‘European miracle’ that has allowed us to remain at the world-best level. But if countries decide to invest less, there is a risk of downgrading. Being left behind means running the risk of never getting back into the race. 

And in the end, you decided to suspend the plan… 

The vast majority of Thales Alenia Space’s adaptation plan, announced in March 2024, has been completed in accordance with the trajectory set by the company. It is continuing for those who are yet to benefit from it. This plan is absolutely necessary in order to restore the profitability and therefore the sustainability of our space business by carrying out internal mobility and without forced departures in France. As originally planned, the adaptation plan is subject to quarterly reviews in consultation with the social partners, who are informed of progress and forecasts. 

How do you explain the delays in the FCAS (Future Combat Air System) project?

From the operational concepts to the technological choices, these are very long-term investments. The first phase of the programme, as far as we’re concerned, aims to mature key technologies around future sensors and communications as well as the concept of the combat cloud. As for phase two, it is not up to Thales to comment. 

The Sunday questions  How do you relax when you head up a company present in several dozen countries? Managing Thales is much more than a job; it’s a passion. And this passion has always given me the energy to forget about being tired! I’ll relax when I retire... as late as possible! What does a good Sunday look like (family, hobbies, sport…). Is there a time when you turn off your phone? Whenever I can, I spend time with my family; it’s my way to recharge my batteries. And to share simple pleasures: a little bit of sport, do maths homework with my sons, or start learning to play an instrument to share their passion for music. Can you share with our readers a memory that is dear to you, related to Sundays? My best Sundays have always been those when I am simply in France with my family.